If the game was called "Minetest Modding Base", "Minetest Core" or whatever, and people were warned it's just a base, it'd be fine. But it's not: Minetest Game is the greatest factor pushing new players away, as it's shipped by default with Minetest, having people thinking it's Minetest itself.
Every time I have someone downloading Minetest - and I'd like to stretch every time - I have to warn them to NOT play in singleplayer, at least not without having downloaded something from ContentDB first. This because, what people expect from a game/engine which resembles MineCRAFT starting by its very name, is to play a MineCRAFT clone by default. So wait: no monsters. No nether. No villagers. No blocks dropped. No challenge. NO GOALS. Hence the uninstalling and the very bad first impression. As I stated multiple times, this is very very very bad advertising. I don't have data, but if I had to guess how many people uninstalled MT after the first experience into a MTG world, it'd be a lot.
Also, I understand MT actually was born as a game, but that idea evidently failed, because this is NOT a game, this is THE FOUNDATION to create a very specific game (Minecraft, which afaik it was the initial goal). This is "create your personal Minecraft without sweating too much... kinda". So, if some developers keep denying that Minetest and Minecraft are the same (paramat actually called it Minecraft-like), this should be at least not be shipped by default. Because the more it gets shipped by default, the more likely modders will create mods depending on it, rooting it into the status quo even more, creating more bad advertising and pushing away more potential players.
And in all honesty, we don't need another Minecraft: pragmatically speaking, people nowadays are not taught the difference between proprietary and free software in school, and definitely it's not a hot topic in general.
[IT CONTINUES IN THE COMMENTS, THERE IS A CHARACTER LIMIT]
Our society is all about productivity and efficiency, there is no time to think about what's ethically right or wrong (and let's be clear, this is bad). People use Blender because today Blender is professional enough, not because it's free software. People rely on Wikipedia because "it's there and it helps", not because it's about free knowledge run by a non-profit (in fact they do the same with Google Books).
All this to say most people won't do the effort to play Minetest instead of Minecraft just because it's free, especially when it's not as efficient/fun as the original. So sod it, let's create something which is not constrained by what Minecraft is in the first place WHILE explaining people the importance of free software! And in order to do so, MTG must go.
I agree with you, because it was exactly like that for me .. I installed it, and I found it boring, I didn't have any real challenges, and I didn't know that there were servers and sub-games ...
falls very badly: /
I have added a new code in the minetest game files which introduces a small hard to make weapon called ender sword. I tried to make it because I thought introducing some endgame tool will make an adventure.
I agree with the technical criticisms of MTG, and I have been a vocal critic of MTG for a long time, so I don't need to add here.
But that weird detour/rant about free software was unneccessary. This attitude of "normal people just don't care about free software" is toxic imho. Normal people don't care about their freedom until they get sued by a megacorporation for copyright infringement. :D
It's a mentality thing as well. Society teaches people that it is "normal" that "everything" is copyrighted and that you, the stupid average user, have no rights while megacorporations have all the rights.
That having said, free software is NO excuse for why MTG sucks. :D
Dethroning MTG is also one of my long-term goals.
Thankfully, MTG is officially in bugfix-only mode now, so this at least forced people to divert resources elsewhere.
As a new user, I'd like to share my experience. Last year I was messing around with a laptop I'd installed Linux Mint when I saw Minetest in the Linux Mint app center. I played for a few minutes trying to figure stuff out. I finally got Minecraft installed, and forgot about Minetest. I owned 2 Minecraft Java accounts, so why bother learning something new? But, the computer was weak and slow, and I had a newer one and forgot all about it. This year, Antvenom made a video about Minetest, and I remembered that weird game I installed on my secondary computer. I've been playing it, and it's good. I tried Mineclone 2 and 5, and they just aren't Minetest enough to take advantage of Minetest's features, and they certainly aren't Minecraft yet. No offense to anyome developing for Mineclone. You guys have a ridiculously large backlog of content to catch up to.
But, Minetest game is really fun. Too bad it is in Bugfix only mode, but the community mods are more than enough to make anything you like out of the game. I do think Minetest game is really simple for new players. I don't know if Mesecraft or Mineclone should come pre-installed, but it's worth a think. New players might benefit from something explaining that they aren't just limited to Minetest game.
TL;DR:
I left Minetest for reasons unrelated to Minetest. When I came back, I did my research and found a lot of cool things. Minetest game, while simple really should stay that way.
I say minetest as a free software is good as you can do whatever you want in the game, code, whatever. Hence I like it. And saying mtg bad doesn't suit me.
If the game was called "Minetest Modding Base", "Minetest Core" or whatever, and people were warned it's just a base, it'd be fine. But it's not: Minetest Game is the greatest factor pushing new players away, as it's shipped by default with Minetest, having people thinking it's Minetest itself.
Every time I have someone downloading Minetest - and I'd like to stretch every time - I have to warn them to NOT play in singleplayer, at least not without having downloaded something from ContentDB first. This because, what people expect from a game/engine which resembles MineCRAFT starting by its very name, is to play a MineCRAFT clone by default. So wait: no monsters. No nether. No villagers. No blocks dropped. No challenge. NO GOALS. Hence the uninstalling and the very bad first impression. As I stated multiple times, this is very very very bad advertising. I don't have data, but if I had to guess how many people uninstalled MT after the first experience into a MTG world, it'd be a lot.
Also, I understand MT actually was born as a game, but that idea evidently failed, because this is NOT a game, this is THE FOUNDATION to create a very specific game (Minecraft, which afaik it was the initial goal). This is "create your personal Minecraft without sweating too much... kinda". So, if some developers keep denying that Minetest and Minecraft are the same (paramat actually called it Minecraft-like), this should be at least not be shipped by default. Because the more it gets shipped by default, the more likely modders will create mods depending on it, rooting it into the status quo even more, creating more bad advertising and pushing away more potential players.
And in all honesty, we don't need another Minecraft: pragmatically speaking, people nowadays are not taught the difference between proprietary and free software in school, and definitely it's not a hot topic in general.
[IT CONTINUES IN THE COMMENTS, THERE IS A CHARACTER LIMIT]
Our society is all about productivity and efficiency, there is no time to think about what's ethically right or wrong (and let's be clear, this is bad). People use Blender because today Blender is professional enough, not because it's free software. People rely on Wikipedia because "it's there and it helps", not because it's about free knowledge run by a non-profit (in fact they do the same with Google Books).
[keep reading]
All this to say most people won't do the effort to play Minetest instead of Minecraft just because it's free, especially when it's not as efficient/fun as the original. So sod it, let's create something which is not constrained by what Minecraft is in the first place WHILE explaining people the importance of free software! And in order to do so, MTG must go.
I agree.
My friend, also a free softwarist, was driven out of MT just because MTG is too disappointing. But I stayed for years thanks to the community mods.
I agree with you, because it was exactly like that for me .. I installed it, and I found it boring, I didn't have any real challenges, and I didn't know that there were servers and sub-games ... falls very badly: /
Yup even me without mods its boring
I have added a new code in the minetest game files which introduces a small hard to make weapon called ender sword. I tried to make it because I thought introducing some endgame tool will make an adventure.
I agree with the technical criticisms of MTG, and I have been a vocal critic of MTG for a long time, so I don't need to add here.
But that weird detour/rant about free software was unneccessary. This attitude of "normal people just don't care about free software" is toxic imho. Normal people don't care about their freedom until they get sued by a megacorporation for copyright infringement. :D It's a mentality thing as well. Society teaches people that it is "normal" that "everything" is copyrighted and that you, the stupid average user, have no rights while megacorporations have all the rights.
That having said, free software is NO excuse for why MTG sucks. :D Dethroning MTG is also one of my long-term goals. Thankfully, MTG is officially in bugfix-only mode now, so this at least forced people to divert resources elsewhere.
As a new user, I'd like to share my experience. Last year I was messing around with a laptop I'd installed Linux Mint when I saw Minetest in the Linux Mint app center. I played for a few minutes trying to figure stuff out. I finally got Minecraft installed, and forgot about Minetest. I owned 2 Minecraft Java accounts, so why bother learning something new? But, the computer was weak and slow, and I had a newer one and forgot all about it. This year, Antvenom made a video about Minetest, and I remembered that weird game I installed on my secondary computer. I've been playing it, and it's good. I tried Mineclone 2 and 5, and they just aren't Minetest enough to take advantage of Minetest's features, and they certainly aren't Minecraft yet. No offense to anyome developing for Mineclone. You guys have a ridiculously large backlog of content to catch up to. But, Minetest game is really fun. Too bad it is in Bugfix only mode, but the community mods are more than enough to make anything you like out of the game. I do think Minetest game is really simple for new players. I don't know if Mesecraft or Mineclone should come pre-installed, but it's worth a think. New players might benefit from something explaining that they aren't just limited to Minetest game.
TL;DR: I left Minetest for reasons unrelated to Minetest. When I came back, I did my research and found a lot of cool things. Minetest game, while simple really should stay that way.
I say minetest as a free software is good as you can do whatever you want in the game, code, whatever. Hence I like it. And saying mtg bad doesn't suit me.